Running performance status / Effective VO2 Max

mbrown956

Hello

I am sorry if I am misunderstanding something, but when I look at the chart showing my running performance status, the plots for each race result show the base VO2 max, rather than the value that has been adjusted for HR & elevation.

In this example, a half-marathon race had a base VO2 max of 51.6. After correction, it is 56.35. It shows on the chart as 51.6.

How can I make the chart show the corrected value?

Thankyou

Laufhannes

The chart shows the values as intended. There are two objectives for the Effective VO2max:

1) Make race results across various distances 'comparable'. That's the 'raw' Effective VO2max based on a race result. It only uses distance and pace and that's a fixed calculation. 21.47 km in 1:30:48 are equivalent to an Effective VO2max of 51.56. Point. There's no discussion. That's based on those tables. And that's useful for races/max efforts only.

2) Use sub-maximal (training) efforts to estimate your potential Effective VO2max. That one uses heart rate (and ascent/descent) to guess/estimate what you could have run at max effort - by assuming a specific max effort heart rate for that duration/distance and using a transformation. In your case, you've been at 87%HRmax and the calculations say that's too low for a max effort half marathon. Running at your max. half marathon heart rate would put you on a 56 VO2max.

That's where the Correction factor comes into play. Some athletes run a half marathon at 92%HRmax, others at 82%HRmax. You can account for that by adjusting your correction factor such that 'based on correction factor' and 'As a race result' are equal.

The Running Performance Status plot now shows your estimated VO2max (based on heart rate/pace of your everyday runs) as a blue line - and your races, what you really achieved, with the 'As a race result' calculation.

Yes, with a correction factor of 1.0 the calculations say: You could have run faster (VO2max of 56), but the actual result is pretty clear: Nope, it's "just" a 51.6. For non-perfect races, it's fine to be below your shape line. For near-perfect races, you want line on circles to match.

mbrown956

Thankyou for the explanation and I'm sorry that you probably deal with this question a lot, I did read the guidance. I suppose what I am looking for is not what this tool provides - I expect the chart to tell me how close a race was to my achievable VO2max, scaling each race entry for effort (average heart rate) and elevation. Perhaps this is because of the wording used - as a user I click on "Effective VO2max" but am then shown a chart showing actual/raw VO2max. My interpretation of the word "Effective" is that it is considering multiple factors to show me effectively what it would be normalised for effort and elevation.

Personally, that is what I would find most useful. Currently I look at the chart and table and can't tell if a value is lower because I took it easy, or because of the elevation, or if it really was max effort and my HR was high. Although I understand I can click an item in the chart to see the elevation and HR.

I can sort of understand why heart rate correction may be excluded, if the intention is to chart and compare VO2max based on actual race performances achieved. But I don't see how that same logic applies to ascent/descent - I would expect the chart to allow me to compare a flat race against a hilly race correcting for elevation. For example, I might run a near-perfect race at max effort throughout on a hilly course - the chart will always rank this lower than a near-perfect max effort on a flat course.

I understand there is the ability to use a correction factor, but this is a fudge - one value will not fix against a variety of different elevations.

I wonder if there might be a way for the chart and the data table to show both raw and corrected for hr/elevation at the same time, or to toggle between the two. Or perhaps just consider the wording/terminology used to make it clearer.

Thanks

Laufhannes

The wording is because the (absolute) VO2max is a scientific metric that can be measured in lab, but it does not take running efficiency into account. Two athletes with same lab VO2max are not necessarily able to race 10k at the same pace. The 'Effective' VO2max is normalized to the race results, such that two athletes with same values are actually able to show equal performances.

But I understand your confusion. We'll think about using the ascent/descent correction in the plot/table. It's not used so far as the ascent/descent correction is not based on a globally accepted rule. Right now every athlete can set his/her own values - and we're going to switch this to use grade-adjusted pace. Still, that won't have the same acceptance as the base VO2max calculations for race results.

So far, I think, there's no location at all in Runalyze where you can analyze Effective VO2max values with elevation correction but without hr correction. But you're right that there is a valid reason to look at it.